#1
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This thread is dedicated to ideas for improving upon the communication between NWI and the server administrators during a game update process.

Please keep your suggestions concise and straight forward. We don't need full biographies of who the feedback is coming from. Focus on the system in its current form and bring suggestions for improving it. This is also a two-way system, so it's not just NWI communicating, but server admins reaching out to us in the proper channels.
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Co-founder & Creative Director of Insurgency
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#2
Heh Finally! Smile

But, I think we all said what needed to be changed in the closed topics, but that is all for NWI to do.
I don't want to start copy-pasting again for obvious reasons.

So I for one, am awaiting the next update including the changelog that's attached to it, and I'll keep a close look on how this thread continues, which can only be for the better if you guys do it right! Smile
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#3
As an ex server host I aint 100% sure my input is totally valid here right now. But I do think this is an area much improved since last year when I was.

The last update had a 4 day warning (thanks Mikee) on the steam hosting group, which imo is more than enough for anybody to find out, get involved on the beta branch and check out the changes for any impacts it has on their stuff.

I mean it took less time to travel to the moon...

If I was to be hyper critical, maybe some lead time from the point where the rc is final and moves from beta to steam would be nice. Maybe posting an announcement about it being rc on the beta branch would get more testers in to give it a quick blast and might help speed up finding any last little niggles which did not effect the regular testers?

I mean I know how much testing goes on, and who are most likely to join in during the beta periods. They, like I, tend to report anything out of place they find and it is soon fixed so the steam branch is a much more stable game for those players. From what I have seen it is often those who do not test on the beta that have the issues and are most vocal about there not being enough testing....
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#4
I agree with frombehind, that notification is good, and the access of the RC in Beta Branch would solve a lot of the problems I have as a modder and server admin. For the remaining issues, might it be better to create a thread for each one rather than have one central discussion? I have about five things that I want to raise, and having them all in one thread may get confusing.
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#5
Something that would improve "NWI TO SERVER ADMIN COMMUNICATION" is the following:

Do not limit Custom Matchmaking/Workshop support to non-private servers please. I would love to be able to simply drop a theater/playlist update for the ESL in the Workshop. All the ESL Server Admins have subscribed to the Workshop-upload in their server configs and therefore only have to reboot their server instead of uploading files all the time.

Besides, if clients subscribe to an equivalent theater/playlist workshop-upload we will also be able to use the matchmaking for private servers. I know, private server should only be accessed via server browser, but why?


My hope is to once have an (custom) ESL Comp tab in the matchmaking, where you then can choose between Ambush, FF and Elimination to see all the servers out there that currently have the ESL Comp theater/playlist installed. ESL Comp is non-private and a place to play comp 5on5 FF via matchmaking against (more skilled, esl experienced) players with esl settings or to easily check out ESL Insurgency as a new players.

Besides, I would like to have a (custom) ESL Match tab in matchmaking, where everyone can choose between Ambush, FF and Elimination to see all the servers out there that currently have the ESL Match theater/playlist installed. ESL Match is for private servers and THE place to play 5on5 ESL Events (Cupmatches, Seasonmatches etc). I can see how many current (up to date) ESL Match servers are out there, get an overview and easily find the one I need to join for the match of an yet unknown enemy.

So no usage of the buggy serverbrowser anymore, direct access via Matchmaking.

cons:
- maybe extra work for devs, because they will have to add a feature of being able to enter a password in mm

pros:
- No Serveradmin of Comp/Match servers will have to manually update their server anymore
- a reboot and your server is up to date, once a new theater has been pushed by ESL Ins Staff
- ESL Ins Staff can then be sure of each server having the right (up to date) theater/playlist running
- Players can be sure the playlist/theater has not been modified in any way - if so, they would not be able to access via mm
- easy access via MM, like players are used to when playing public ins
- better way to adress ESL players/teams if all runs through those workshop uploads
- easy to understand for players and serveradmins, that did not have studied how there is thousands of different ways to setup an insserver
...

Can come up with some more, but that should be enough for now.


Is that doable.. somehow?
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#6
(20-01-2016, 02:42)mr.pink Wrote: Something that would improve "NWI TO SERVER ADMIN COMMUNICATION" is...

Them responding to the questions asked and possibilities already suggested in this thread, which they specifically made for that reason only?

Just a thought...

They must be too busy working on their now WWII mod...



mr.pink: not attacking or taking it out of context.. just using that for obvious reasons Smile
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#7
I already got my answer elsewhere, thank you.
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#8
My suggestions to improve the update process:

* Inform up font when an update is scheduled / re-scheduled so server admins can prepare / plan the update.
* Inform upcoming "structural" changes that possibly break mod or theaters (not so much new things or value changes nut more so class refactoring or different location for files etc). It would be very helpful when this is communicated as early as possible but preferably not after the notification when an update is going to take place.
[S.O.] Tactical Teamplay server (Search and Destroy - Realism mod) - 89.163.222.83:21854
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#9
Another 2 weeks have past without any serious response, feedback, questions or discussion from NWI on this matter. The only thing changed (so far) is yet another thread where the same issues have been brought up.

NWI, are you taking this serious and can we get this conversation going?
[S.O.] Tactical Teamplay server (Search and Destroy - Realism mod) - 89.163.222.83:21854
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#10
I wonder the same, but I have my doubts.
This is probably just another "let's shut them up by making this thread" thread. It is starting to look like it, isn't it.
If so, then it just proves everything I said in the previous topics.
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#11
So... About this hotfix that is currenlty waiting to be downloaded in my steam client.
Does this apply only to the clients, or also to the servers?

Any notification about this would be appreciated though!
Just like about the extra not-change-logged changes in the theater files.
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#12
Making process changes internally that will improve things are going to take more than one update, so please shift your expectations accordingly. I know your patience are thin at this point. 

We give notice to you as soon as we know. We give you the change list as soon as we have it made. You have full access to the beta branch ahead of release to know what is changing. We often test for several days in advance of release - hopefully enough time to test and fix any mods that are not working as intended. One of our team members has volunteered to provide information about theater changes, so you will know what has changed in the scripts with future updates.

We will also be more willing to engage in a discussion when the disrespectful tone is dropped.
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#13
(29-01-2016, 15:31)Argyll Wrote: Making process changes internally that will improve things are going to take more than one update, so please shift your expectations accordingly. I know your patience are thin at this point. 

We give notice to you as soon as we know. We give you the change list as soon as we have it made. You have full access to the beta branch ahead of release to know what is changing. We often test for several days in advance of release - hopefully enough time to test and fix any mods that are not working as intended. One of our team members has volunteered to provide information about theater changes, so you will know what has changed in the scripts with future updates.

We will also be more willing to engage in a discussion when the disrespectful tone is dropped.

Good!
Also, I found some especially theaterrelated changes in the changelog. Also the example stuff has been updated. For now Iam happy.

Maybe it is too easy now, so that some admins have time to moan more than before (due to not needed trial&error theaterfixes) Wink


@Splifz
I bet (hope) the hotfix fixed e.g. the bug when shooting in water. This one is pretty urgent for comp play :/ Besides there were still some issues about DOI.. red particel bug etc pp. There has to be another way than just "verify files and re-subscribe...
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#14
(29-01-2016, 15:31)Argyll Wrote: Making process changes internally that will improve things are going to take more than one update, so please shift your expectations accordingly. I know your patience are thin at this point. 

We give notice to you as soon as we know. We give you the change list as soon as we have it made. You have full access to the beta branch ahead of release to know what is changing. We often test for several days in advance of release - hopefully enough time to test and fix any mods that are not working as intended. One of our team members has volunteered to provide information about theater changes, so you will know what has changed in the scripts with future updates.

We will also be more willing to engage in a discussion when the disrespectful tone is dropped.

The notification for the update was 20 minutes before it was pushed through. So within these 20 minutes, we have to go through all the files on the whole beta server to spot any differences, just to wait for a hotfix (which is bound to happen, everytime!)? We have no idea when you put a release through, because there is no standard update cycle or day on which it happens, so the 'We often test for several days in advance of release - hopefully enough time to test and fix any mods that are not working as intended' is kind off difficult for us to see or even be part in for ourselfs to find out what has, or is going to change.
The changelog this time was a nice change though, got to give you that. Except for the small things that weren't in there and had to find them by comparing it with previous theaters. Could happen I guess.

Then the hotfix.. still no idea what has changed and apparently needed to update the server for it too. The previous few where just client-side updates. Also, There was no notification of this prior for it happened, which is kind of contrasting with what you just said about giving notice 'as soon as we know'.
Even the devs of Squad put out a notification/news item for the hotfix. It can't be that difficult.

And I think we have patience enough, but we just waited 2 weeks for some 10 lines post from you, while you specifically made this thread for making the communication between NWI and us, server admins, better. Some more interaction would be appreciated I guess Smile


@mr.pink
I hope so too.. but we won't know until we find it out ourselfs again Smile
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#15
Add admin password to server.cfg, no server pass or rcon pass, admin pass, and when a player tries to connect to the server asks.
If the password is correct even if the server is full, the player can enter as a spectator to expel someone.
Or that own menu from the server can be done.
It's very frustrating not being able to get your own server because it is full, and no one to make a hole.
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